Lily
Administrator
Posts: 2,197
Joined: May 2011
|
Post by Lily on Aug 12, 2011 19:03:48 GMT -5
|
|
Richard
Member
Posts: 610
Joined: July 2011
|
Post by Richard on Aug 12, 2011 19:11:55 GMT -5
|
|
Lily
Administrator
Posts: 2,197
Joined: May 2011
|
Post by Lily on Aug 12, 2011 19:24:47 GMT -5
You're right, Richard. These were definitely RACE riots. They were triggered when a black man was shot and killed by the police. And it was black people who were rioting. Denying and ignoring a problem won't make it go away. Honest and open dialogue is needed. Much like the Muslim league in the UK has done. I think they've made progress in dispelling a lot of the myths and misunderstandings that sweeping it under the rug inevitably brings. For one thing, they've called for a halt to the all-out war against Christmas. They stated that Muslims have no objection at all to Christmas. In fact, many of them send out cards and exchange gifts. This is important, because it's the Politically Correct Liberals who have attacked Christmas, and minority groups, such as the Muslims are unfairly resented and blamed for it. I'd also like to add here that racial discrimination and subsequent riots are part of British history. There is such a consciousness of race and what nationality you are in the UK, because being an island has left us more homogenised than most. www.york.ac.uk/ipup/projects/raceandfaith/discussion/bam-hutchison.html
|
|
Lily
Administrator
Posts: 2,197
Joined: May 2011
|
Post by Lily on Aug 13, 2011 12:01:31 GMT -5
|
|
Lily
Administrator
Posts: 2,197
Joined: May 2011
|
Post by Lily on Aug 13, 2011 14:59:58 GMT -5
There is also a huge economic underclass in the UK, largely due to the class system, which still predominates every facet of life there. The blacks who rioted this week also belong to this underclass. However, they were not rioting over their economic situation this time, but about the shooting of a black man, and racial discrimination. So those who attempt to deny the racial nature of this latest round of riots by pushing the "economic underclass" aspect of it, are being singularly dishonest. They are for the most part Politically Correct liberals, who have lobbied hard for increased immigration, extolled the joys of multicult, and were determined to achieve a "racially diverse" UK. Not so "diverse" when you consider that white Britons will be in the minority, in what was once their own country, in a matter of a few years. But they were determined that they knew best even when faced with proof from other countries that multiculturalism does not work. And that the racial diversity they so craved would lead to race riots and white-flight. Which it has. www.bnp.org.uk/
|
|
Richard
Member
Posts: 610
Joined: July 2011
|
Post by Richard on Aug 13, 2011 16:40:16 GMT -5
Unfortunately Race and Culture are two of the most divisive issues in the world, and those in positions of authority only inflame these issues for their own means instead of trying to solve any underlying problems.
They will never do that, only exploit it for their own gain.
The ironic thing is that most of the time riots such as these, no matter where they occur, only hurt those who have no part in it.
|
|
Lily
Administrator
Posts: 2,197
Joined: May 2011
|
Post by Lily on Aug 13, 2011 18:05:44 GMT -5
Unfortunately Race and Culture are two of the most divisive issues in the world, and those in positions of authority only inflame these issues for their own means instead of trying to solve any underlying problems. They will never do that, only exploit it for their own gain. The ironic thing is that most of the time riots such as these, no matter where they occur, only hurt those who have no part in it. Exactly! It's important to place the blame where it belongs, and that is on government, not the immigrants, who are unfortunately the pawns and scapegoats in all of this. In Canada, the government is responsible for the unworkable and destructive "multicult" fiasco, which encourages immigrants to continue practising their own language/culture, etc. This, of course, is detrimental inasmuch as they end up in a language ghetto, shut out from the mainstream. One of its biggest critics, and one of the most effective, is a Simon Fraser University Professor, who also happens to be East Indian. He advocates assimilation rather than the marginalisation that's inevitable with multiculturalism. And of course, they cannot accuse him of being a "racist" for saying so. My things have come to a sorry pass when we are afraid to voice our honest opinions lest we be branded a "hate monger." And when opinion is forced underground like this it gains in strength and builds to a veritable volcano of frustration and anger. The riots this week may be just the beginning of much worse to come.
|
|
charlotte
Member
Posts: 36
Joined: August 2011
|
Post by charlotte on Aug 17, 2011 12:22:00 GMT -5
I'm in the UK - I don't think it is all black people rioting (not to mention most of those who are black and rioting are British not really an immigration issue). If anything it is people reacting to racism within the police force. You'd get people of all races objecting to that - all right thinking people would condemn that as much as the riots. People of all social classes, ages and races are amongst those arrested. It is a time of change in the country and for the first time since the Industrial Revolution we have a whole generation that is feeling more disenfranchised and is far less well off than their parents. Prior to this one standards of education, hygiene, employment, comfort have grown right now it is going backwards. We are dealing with service cuts - protests have happened across Europe for the same reasons. Rioting plays its part in moving a society forwards it may not be a great way to behave but thing is The Magna Carta, improved working laws, improved suffrage, improved treatment of Roman Catholics in Northern Ireland have all come about when people have turned round and said no. Even the European revolutions had their impact because our government worked to prevent them. Some fight politically and some fight physically the combination has worked very well in the UK. The debate we are having in our media, in parliament etc is one that would never have happened without them. Brits have been integrating immigrants since Roman times, then there were the Angles, the Saxons, the Vikings etc. There are some teething problems always as the groups work things out but then culture moves forward enriched. It is still happening - quite funny it is now black immigrant families of the sixties complaining about eastern europeans We have a damn good record of doing it quicker than most other societies. Long may that continue, the black immigration brought some amazing changes to British culture and I am seeing the ones the Eastern Europeans are bringing. With them comes some bad things but that has always been the case. They are also improving our work ethics and playgrounds are becoming a more fun place to be with the kids. The very fact the BNP do get air time and have a party show that tolerance is all well and good. The government could do with taking a leaf out of Prince Charles book he's put his money where his mouth is and the Princes Youth Trust has a good record in these areas.
|
|
Lily
Administrator
Posts: 2,197
Joined: May 2011
|
Post by Lily on Aug 17, 2011 13:12:10 GMT -5
Good points, Charlotte. Since you live in the UK, your input is appreciated. It's difficult to know from afar, as we are, exactly what is going on. There are articles which state this was definitely a race riot, and others that don't mention it. But either way, it's always the squeaky wheel that gets the grease. So if people don't let their discontent be known, change is unlikely.
By what you say, it seems that this started out as race riots after a black man was shot and killed by the police. But that this changed later on into riots by the economically downtrodden as well.
I'm British myself, so very supportive of the UK. However, it never did make sense to me why such a small country would encourage immigration on such a vast scale, rather than improve conditions so native born Brits would not be forced to immigrate on an equally vast scale.
As for racism, I can address it from personal experience. Being both Scottish and English, I felt it quite acutely while in Edinburgh -- the hatred of all things English. So if there's racial dislike such as this, of those who look the same and have been brought up in the same culture and religion, it's not surprising that immigrants from Asia and Africa are subjected to it as well.
I'm not saying that the UK is more racially prejudiced than anywhere else. But I believe it is more overt there. I guess on the plus side this is at least more honest, and therefore, can be addressed. To legislate racism into silence and then pretend it no longer exists (as in Canada) is helpful to no one.
|
|
charlotte
Member
Posts: 36
Joined: August 2011
|
Post by charlotte on Aug 17, 2011 14:36:55 GMT -5
Things have changed a lot in the past twenty years and right now racism in everyday life is more likely to be aimed at Eastern Europeans. The situation with the English in Scotland has improved considerably in the 18 years I have lived in Scotland and again it is pockets of bad behaviour rather than endemic. I think the riots come because in Britain it isn't acceptable - the worst examples of racism I have ever seen are in US airports. John Barrowman speaks with an American accent because he was bullied at school in illinois for being Scots. I don't think it is anymore overt than anywhere else.
However the people rioting are not immigrants or not all immigrants many are third generation Brits. Now the riots in Toxteth and Brixton were race riots. This one is a combination of many things. I couldn't imagine Britain with out diversity it wouldn't function the same - Indian food is now pretty well traditional English fayre lol The culture is what it is because of constant immigration throughout thousands of years and it does have problems but it also integrates groups of people a lot faster than most other cultures. Always has.
|
|
Lily
Administrator
Posts: 2,197
Joined: May 2011
|
Post by Lily on Aug 17, 2011 14:51:28 GMT -5
I don't think it is anymore overt than anywhere else. Perhaps not among adults, who would naturally be a lot more circumspect. I believe uttering racial slurs is now a crime in the UK, as it is here in Canada. My experience was when I was going to school, and it came from other kids. Of course, where did the kids learn it from, is the obvious question? ;D
|
|
Lily
Administrator
Posts: 2,197
Joined: May 2011
|
Post by Lily on Aug 17, 2011 18:23:17 GMT -5
|
|
Lily
Administrator
Posts: 2,197
Joined: May 2011
|
Post by Lily on Aug 17, 2011 18:27:53 GMT -5
|
|
Lily
Administrator
Posts: 2,197
Joined: May 2011
|
Post by Lily on Sept 4, 2011 11:35:29 GMT -5
|
|
dervish
Member
Posts: 60
Joined: July 2011
|
Post by dervish on Sept 5, 2011 11:48:27 GMT -5
I don't blame the sorry losers that rioted but the authoroties for allowing it to happen. I really dug that bloke on the vid, he rocks.
|
|